Home SK - Stocks, Property, Investment Chamas - Investment Groups BIZ - Small Business Soko - Market Wazua Life About Wazua
SIGN IN REGISTER
Friday, Dec 13, 2019
Club SK
To contribute to these and use other features, please register.
LATEST DISCUSSIONS
BREXIT [233]
New NYS Scandal [318]
Why I reject the BBI [205]
Sonko for Nairobi Governor [938]
Nairobi Rains [324]
Black Jews AKA lost tribes of Israel [98]
Waiguru’s buys ball pens at Sh8,700 each!!!!!!!!!!... [324]
Narok maasai mara university ponyoka na mamilioni [28]
Okoth Obado Case [481]
Shocking Jubilee secret MEGA projects!!!!!!!!!!!!!... [128]
POTUS TRUMP [1386]
Where is @Alma? [46]
What has your governor done for you? [696]
Evangelist Reinhard Bonnke [64]
Alternative investment-Sport pesa [2215]
 
Forum Jump








Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Log In

5 Pages<1234>»
Punguza Mizigo Bill
limanika
#21 Posted : Sunday, July 21, 2019 9:29:23 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,983
FRM2011 wrote:
Is @maka still active on wazua ?

Would want to know whether the county assemblies or parliament can amend the bill as presented. Or approve some sections and reject others.

The proposal on fighting corruption is not a bad one. It gives the DPP powers to operationalize chapter 6 of the constitution. He will have powers to ask anyone mentioned adversely by the auditor General, PAC or PIC to vacate office immediately.

It also expands the definition of corruption to instances where the public does not get value for money.


We still dont have a substantive referendum law, hence will have to rely on the (quite) deficient provisions in the katiba. That means, once the signatures are verified by IEBC, the bill can't be amended, and would have to go all the way. If you change any clause then you have to go back to the 1m who supported the initiative and ask them to endorse!

That's where we fault aukot and chebukati. Aukot should have involved more stakeholders during the drafting of the bill. I find it very cunning of him to include sweeteners for MCA's just so they can pass the bill. Its like burying our heads in the sand. Chebukati on the other hand should have refused to take it forward to counties unless we have a substantive law on referendum. Sadly, I don't it will go far
FRM2011
#22 Posted : Sunday, July 21, 2019 12:39:32 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/5/2010
Posts: 2,403
limanika wrote:
FRM2011 wrote:
Is @maka still active on wazua ?

Would want to know whether the county assemblies or parliament can amend the bill as presented. Or approve some sections and reject others.

The proposal on fighting corruption is not a bad one. It gives the DPP powers to operationalize chapter 6 of the constitution. He will have powers to ask anyone mentioned adversely by the auditor General, PAC or PIC to vacate office immediately.

It also expands the definition of corruption to instances where the public does not get value for money.


We still dont have a substantive referendum law, hence will have to rely on the (quite) deficient provisions in the katiba. That means, once the signatures are verified by IEBC, the bill can't be amended, and would have to go all the way. If you change any clause then you have to go back to the 1m who supported the initiative and ask them to endorse!

That's where we fault aukot and chebukati. Aukot should have involved more stakeholders during the drafting of the bill. I find it very cunning of him to include sweeteners for MCA's just so they can pass the bill. Its like burying our heads in the sand. Chebukati on the other hand should have refused to take it forward to counties unless we have a substantive law on referendum. Sadly, I don't it will go far


Thanks for he clarification. It's a pity really. It seems he doesn't understand this is a political process.

I have seen a legal advisory in ODM circles ( I am still active there). The sweetener to MCAs to replace CDF with ward development fund is not possible legally.

The CDF had to rebrand to NG-CDF to survive post-devolution. Counties can create WDF and some have even started. But not from the national government budget.
Ngalaka
#23 Posted : Sunday, July 21, 2019 1:22:59 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/29/2008
Posts: 1,535
limanika wrote:
FRM2011 wrote:
Is @maka still active on wazua ?

Would want to know whether the county assemblies or parliament can amend the bill as presented. Or approve some sections and reject others.

The proposal on fighting corruption is not a bad one. It gives the DPP powers to operationalize chapter 6 of the constitution. He will have powers to ask anyone mentioned adversely by the auditor General, PAC or PIC to vacate office immediately.

It also expands the definition of corruption to instances where the public does not get value for money.


We still dont have a substantive referendum law, hence will have to rely on the (quite) deficient provisions in the katiba. That means, once the signatures are verified by IEBC, the bill can't be amended, and would have to go all the way. If you change any clause then you have to go back to the 1m who supported the initiative and ask them to endorse!

That's where we fault aukot and chebukati. Aukot should have involved more stakeholders during the drafting of the bill. I find it very cunning of him to include sweeteners for MCA's just so they can pass the bill. Its like burying our heads in the sand. Chebukati on the other hand should have refused to take it forward to counties unless we have a substantive law on referendum. Sadly, I don't it will go far

It will have to be appreciated that there is another effort at referendum that is parallel to Aukot's.
There will have to be some horse trading and rationalization.
Isuni yilu yi maa me muyo - ni Mbisuu
alma1
#24 Posted : Sunday, July 21, 2019 6:19:21 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/19/2015
Posts: 2,559
Location: hapo
My theory has come to pass.

Thieves are not good people. Tumeelewana?
mkenyan
#25 Posted : Sunday, July 21, 2019 7:07:29 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/1/2009
Posts: 1,778
FRM2011 wrote:
limanika wrote:
FRM2011 wrote:
Is @maka still active on wazua ?

Would want to know whether the county assemblies or parliament can amend the bill as presented. Or approve some sections and reject others.

The proposal on fighting corruption is not a bad one. It gives the DPP powers to operationalize chapter 6 of the constitution. He will have powers to ask anyone mentioned adversely by the auditor General, PAC or PIC to vacate office immediately.

It also expands the definition of corruption to instances where the public does not get value for money.


We still dont have a substantive referendum law, hence will have to rely on the (quite) deficient provisions in the katiba. That means, once the signatures are verified by IEBC, the bill can't be amended, and would have to go all the way. If you change any clause then you have to go back to the 1m who supported the initiative and ask them to endorse!

That's where we fault aukot and chebukati. Aukot should have involved more stakeholders during the drafting of the bill. I find it very cunning of him to include sweeteners for MCA's just so they can pass the bill. Its like burying our heads in the sand. Chebukati on the other hand should have refused to take it forward to counties unless we have a substantive law on referendum. Sadly, I don't it will go far


Thanks for he clarification. It's a pity really. It seems he doesn't understand this is a political process.

I have seen a legal advisory in ODM circles ( I am still active there). The sweetener to MCAs to replace CDF with ward development fund is not possible legally.

The CDF had to rebrand to NG-CDF to survive post-devolution. Counties can create WDF and some have even started. But not from the national government budget.

you realise that if the constitution is amended to provide that then it would be very legal? you can't get any more legal that a constitutional provision. who is this mis-advising odm on such?
limanika
#26 Posted : Sunday, July 21, 2019 8:47:33 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,983
I think such drastic changes in the system of representation should be more consultative. If you don't consult widely and lobby for political support then you might not go far with this kind of initiative. There are already questions as to whether IEBC is properly constituted to preside over this. The courts might have to decide.
2012
#27 Posted : Monday, July 22, 2019 7:33:54 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,564
Location: Nairobi
It was a very clever move to target the backing of the MCAs. If it's passed by 24 county assemblies, Parliament will have no say in the matter.

Stand for something or you will fall for anything. Today's mighty oak is yesterday's nut that held its ground. Rosa Parks
newfarer
#28 Posted : Monday, July 22, 2019 8:37:41 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/19/2010
Posts: 3,365
Location: Uganda
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption
punda amecheka
Lolest!
#29 Posted : Tuesday, July 23, 2019 8:05:04 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 11,783
Location: Kianjokoma
newfarer wrote:
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption

Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
limanika
#30 Posted : Tuesday, July 23, 2019 8:32:17 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,983
newfarer wrote:
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption

How can 1.2m signatures be collected and nobody I know signed up? Where was the signing done? I Never heard of a desk in my ward or constituency to sign up. At least for BBI we know they're visiting all counties. And the main issue, how exactly did IEBC verify and confirm that the signatures are valid? By the way, from where I sit, increasing money to counties and creating WDF is not the solution. Infact this will lead to entrenchment of corruption that has already now been devolved from central govt
Lolest!
#31 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2019 2:38:34 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 11,783
Location: Kianjokoma
limanika wrote:
newfarer wrote:
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption

How can 1.2m signatures be collected and nobody I know signed up? Where was the signing done? I Never heard of a desk in my ward or constituency to sign up. At least for BBI we know they're visiting all counties. And the main issue, how exactly did IEBC verify and confirm that the signatures are valid? By the way, from where I sit, increasing money to counties and creating WDF is not the solution. Infact this will lead to entrenchment of corruption that has already now been devolved from central govt

I know 1 person who signed. He told me that it was an online process
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
newfarer
#32 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2019 6:11:39 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/19/2010
Posts: 3,365
Location: Uganda
Lolest! wrote:
limanika wrote:
newfarer wrote:
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption

How can 1.2m signatures be collected and nobody I know signed up? Where was the signing done? I Never heard of a desk in my ward or constituency to sign up. At least for BBI we know they're visiting all counties. And the main issue, how exactly did IEBC verify and confirm that the signatures are valid? By the way, from where I sit, increasing money to counties and creating WDF is not the solution. Infact this will lead to entrenchment of corruption that has already now been devolved from central govt

I know 1 person who signed. He told me that it was an online process

eukot alicheza ball ya chini.he is a clever fellow and may win as others make noise
punda amecheka
2012
#33 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2019 11:33:01 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,564
Location: Nairobi
Lolest! wrote:
limanika wrote:
newfarer wrote:
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption

How can 1.2m signatures be collected and nobody I know signed up? Where was the signing done? I Never heard of a desk in my ward or constituency to sign up. At least for BBI we know they're visiting all counties. And the main issue, how exactly did IEBC verify and confirm that the signatures are valid? By the way, from where I sit, increasing money to counties and creating WDF is not the solution. Infact this will lead to entrenchment of corruption that has already now been devolved from central govt

I know 1 person who signed. He told me that it was an online process


I don't doubt its authenticity because I would have signed it myself if I'd received or known about it.

Stand for something or you will fall for anything. Today's mighty oak is yesterday's nut that held its ground. Rosa Parks
limanika
#34 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2019 11:55:34 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,983
2012 wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
limanika wrote:
newfarer wrote:
it may go through.

https://www.standardmedi...dy-won-referendum-race.

either way we are damned.whether MCA or MPs they will just enrich themselves and their selves.kila mtu achunge mzigo wake.we first need a societal change of attitude to corruption

How can 1.2m signatures be collected and nobody I know signed up? Where was the signing done? I Never heard of a desk in my ward or constituency to sign up. At least for BBI we know they're visiting all counties. And the main issue, how exactly did IEBC verify and confirm that the signatures are valid? By the way, from where I sit, increasing money to counties and creating WDF is not the solution. Infact this will lead to entrenchment of corruption that has already now been devolved from central govt

I know 1 person who signed. He told me that it was an online process


I don't doubt its authenticity because I would have signed it myself if I'd received or known about it.

OK, but how did IEBC confirm the signature (and all others) are genuine? Do they have a depository of all signatures?
maka
#35 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2019 12:22:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,249
Location: Nairobi
FRM2011 wrote:
Is @maka still active on wazua ?

Would want to know whether the county assemblies or parliament can amend the bill as presented. Or approve some sections and reject others.

The proposal on fighting corruption is not a bad one. It gives the DPP powers to operationalize chapter 6 of the constitution. He will have powers to ask anyone mentioned adversely by the auditor General, PAC or PIC to vacate office immediately.

It also expands the definition of corruption to instances where the public does not get value for money.



Article 257 Sub article (8) and (9)....

The bill cannot be changed.
possunt quia posse videntur
Lolest!
#36 Posted : Friday, August 02, 2019 8:51:47 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 11,783
Location: Kianjokoma
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
Impunity
#37 Posted : Friday, August 02, 2019 9:48:34 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,183
Location: Masada
Lolest! wrote:


Aniiita, anita wangu, bebelielieee…

...now you know...

Sad Sad Sad
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

hardwood
#38 Posted : Friday, August 02, 2019 10:03:44 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,553
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Impunity wrote:
Lolest! wrote:


Aniiita, anita wangu, bebelielieee…

...now you know...

Sad Sad Sad


It was for gender balance manenos to comply with new katiba.
Queen
#39 Posted : Saturday, August 03, 2019 9:59:11 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/21/2018
Posts: 182
Location: Britain
When virtually all politicians gang up against Aukot's Bill, just know that this must be a good bill which is pro- Wanjiku and anti-selfish/useless politicians.
kingfisher
#40 Posted : Monday, August 05, 2019 9:40:40 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/9/2008
Posts: 2,814
limanika wrote:
I think such drastic changes in the system of representation should be more consultative. If you don't consult widely and lobby for political support then you might not go far with this kind of initiative. There are already questions as to whether IEBC is properly constituted to preside over this. The courts might have to decide.


Who was to be consulted? ODM? Jubilee? Wiper? Hacha hiyo story. They are doing theirs called BBI lt them bring it on when ready.

Punguza mzigo will go all the way....
When I have money, I get rid of it quickly, lest it find a way into my heart.
Users browsing this topic
Guest
5 Pages<1234>»
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Home | . .. Investor | .. . Groups | .. . SME | . . . Market | .. . Club SK | . ..... About Wazua | . .. Search | . ..Sitemap | . ..Support | . ..Disclaimer | . ..Privacy Policy | . ..Terms of Use | . .. Contact Us
Copyright © 2019 Wazua.co.ke. All Rights Reserved.