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Jamii Bora Makao (Kisaju) backfires
Mucene
#1 Posted : Friday, July 12, 2013 2:05:59 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/4/2012
Posts: 155
Location: Kenya
The cheap housing model spearheaded by Jamii
Bora in Kajiado has come under severe test as
the low-income buyers say they are unable to
repay the mortgages.
Urbanis, the developer that took over the
project from Jamii Bora Makao, said high
interest rates have pushed up the mortgages,
making it hard for the low-income buyers to
pay.

businessdailyafrica.com/Jamii-Bora-home-buyers-face-eviction--/-/539546/1912270/-/g04dxq/-/index.html
If you don't want to go to plan B have a good plan A.
a4architect.com
#2 Posted : Friday, July 12, 2013 2:16:31 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 1,668
Location: nairobi
check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...Province,+Kenya&z=16
As Iron Sharpens Iron, So one Man Sharpens Another.
webish
#3 Posted : Friday, July 12, 2013 4:07:47 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/19/2009
Posts: 670
Location: Nairobi
Would be interesting to see how they handle this. The Big guy said they are ready for "talks".

I personally thought they had done the mortgages using a fixed-rate interest. For the rest of players who are targeting that market segment, Time to take notes and learn.

Life is joy, death is peace, but the transition is very difficult.
mpobiz
#4 Posted : Friday, July 12, 2013 11:47:53 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,737
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
maka
#5 Posted : Saturday, July 13, 2013 10:46:04 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,237
Location: Nairobi
mpobiz wrote:
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.


Boss have you been to Kisaju?
You cant stay in this place and work in Nairobi...labda rongai or kiserian and thats still far btw this means you,ll have to rent another house for easier access to your work/business area and still pay a mortgage on your kisaju house which will most likely have no tenant coz no one would want to live there...I had said it before this was not a properly planned project to early for such an area.
possunt quia posse videntur
Mucene
#6 Posted : Saturday, July 13, 2013 11:42:54 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 8/4/2012
Posts: 155
Location: Kenya
Since the place is about 20Km from Konza probably those who keep up the payments will benefit greatly once Konza becomes a reality
If you don't want to go to plan B have a good plan A.
a4architect.com
#7 Posted : Saturday, July 13, 2013 12:09:48 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 1,668
Location: nairobi
maka wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.


Boss have you been to Kisaju?
You cant stay in this place and work in Nairobi...labda rongai or kiserian and thats still far btw this means you,ll have to rent another house for easier access to your work/business area and still pay a mortgage on your kisaju house which will most likely have no tenant coz no one would want to live there...I had said it before this was not a properly planned project to early for such an area.


@maka..very brilliant observation. Ingrid Munro is an architect so she should have known better. Nairobi CBD feeds a radius of 40 km from its epicentre.

Land 50km and above from nairobi will need its own economic activity for sustenance. She could have done a JV with Amiran for the greenhouse farming or anything that can generate income to the occupants. Another solution was to design the houses such that construction cost is far much lower.

The same situation will befall Konza city investors who do not plan well.
Buildings, no matter how smart they are, do not exist without other factors such as proximity to existing cities/towns, proximity to raw materials etc etc.
As Iron Sharpens Iron, So one Man Sharpens Another.
mpobiz
#8 Posted : Sunday, July 14, 2013 1:03:27 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,737
a4architect.com wrote:
maka wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.


Boss have you been to Kisaju?
You cant stay in this place and work in Nairobi...labda rongai or kiserian and thats still far btw this means you,ll have to rent another house for easier access to your work/business area and still pay a mortgage on your kisaju house which will most likely have no tenant coz no one would want to live there...I had said it before this was not a properly planned project to early for such an area.


@maka..very brilliant observation. Ingrid Munro is an architect so she should have known better. Nairobi CBD feeds a radius of 40 km from its epicentre.

Land 50km and above from nairobi will need its own economic activity for sustenance. She could have done a JV with Amiran for the greenhouse farming or anything that can generate income to the occupants. Another solution was to design the houses such that construction cost is far much lower.

The same situation will befall Konza city investors who do not plan well.
Buildings, no matter how smart they are, do not exist without other factors such as proximity to existing cities/towns, proximity to raw materials etc etc.


You still can't see it people. I once had a chat with a man who after retirement, he went to his rural home in nyahururu. After a year he come back and rented a house in ruai. During his working days he decided to develop his rural home where he built a house and other farm infrastructure. Recently him and his son started to pay for one of those houses at kisaju and now lives there and his wife.
The reason he couldn't live in his rural area was because according to him one grows old ten times much faster in ocha than in Tao
He considers that since Nairobi metropolis comes all the way to kitengela, he is better of at kisaju than in nyahururu
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
symbols
#9 Posted : Sunday, July 14, 2013 1:09:37 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/19/2013
Posts: 2,552
mpobiz wrote:

You still can't see it people. I once had a chat with a man who after retirement, he went to his rural home in nyahururu. After a year he come back and rented a house in ruai. During his working days he decided to develop his rural home where he built a house and other farm infrastructure. Recently him and his son started to pay for one of those houses at kisaju and now lives there and his wife.
The reason he couldn't live in his rural area was because according to him one grows old ten times much faster in ocha than in Tao
He considers that since Nairobi metropolis comes all the way to kitengela, he is better of at kisaju than in nyahururu


please explain?
wanyee
#10 Posted : Sunday, July 14, 2013 11:59:32 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 7/17/2011
Posts: 627
Location: Mbui-Nzau, Kikumbulyu
have always have the opinion that besides everything else ..most of these slum dwellers have a psychological problem
Rankaz13
#11 Posted : Sunday, July 14, 2013 1:17:47 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/21/2013
Posts: 2,838
Location: Here
wanyee wrote:
have always have the opinion that besides everything else ..most of these slum dwellers have a psychological problem


Here I was thinking it's purely an economic issueSad Sad
Life is like playing a violin solo in public and learning the instrument as one goes on.
Kaigangio
#12 Posted : Sunday, July 14, 2013 4:36:49 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/27/2007
Posts: 2,768
mpobiz wrote:
a4architect.com wrote:
maka wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.


Boss have you been to Kisaju?
You cant stay in this place and work in Nairobi...labda rongai or kiserian and thats still far btw this means you,ll have to rent another house for easier access to your work/business area and still pay a mortgage on your kisaju house which will most likely have no tenant coz no one would want to live there...I had said it before this was not a properly planned project to early for such an area.


@maka..very brilliant observation. Ingrid Munro is an architect so she should have known better. Nairobi CBD feeds a radius of 40 km from its epicentre.

Land 50km and above from nairobi will need its own economic activity for sustenance. She could have done a JV with Amiran for the greenhouse farming or anything that can generate income to the occupants. Another solution was to design the houses such that construction cost is far much lower.

The same situation will befall Konza city investors who do not plan well.
Buildings, no matter how smart they are, do not exist without other factors such as proximity to existing cities/towns, proximity to raw materials etc etc.


You still can't see it people. I once had a chat with a man who after retirement, he went to his rural home in nyahururu. After a year he come back and rented a house in ruai. During his working days he decided to develop his rural home where he built a house and other farm infrastructure. Recently him and his son started to pay for one of those houses at kisaju and now lives there and his wife.
The reason he couldn't live in his rural area was because according to him one grows old ten times much faster in ocha than in Tao
He considers that since Nairobi metropolis comes all the way to kitengela, he is better of at kisaju than in nyahururu


@ mpobiz

You might wish to explain why we have a large number of old population in shags than in town...what is that special that rural folk eat that urban don't which makes them live longer than?
...besides, the presence of a safe alone does not signify that there is money inside...
a4architect.com
#13 Posted : Monday, July 15, 2013 9:10:16 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 1,668
Location: nairobi
Rankaz13 wrote:
wanyee wrote:
have always have the opinion that besides everything else ..most of these slum dwellers have a psychological problem


Here I was thinking it's purely an economic issueSad Sad


@wanyee.. its more of an economic issue. Life in the slum is quite rough, hence the occupants sometimes acting they way they do. Its more of learnt socialized behavior than inborn trait.
As Iron Sharpens Iron, So one Man Sharpens Another.
mpobiz
#14 Posted : Tuesday, July 16, 2013 1:23:54 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,737
Kaigangio wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
a4architect.com wrote:
maka wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.


Boss have you been to Kisaju?
You cant stay in this place and work in Nairobi...labda rongai or kiserian and thats still far btw this means you,ll have to rent another house for easier access to your work/business area and still pay a mortgagees on your kisaju house which will most likely have no tenant coz no one would want to live there...I had said it before this was not a properly planned project to early for such an area.


@maka..very brilliant observation. Ingrid Munro is an architect so she should have known better. Nairobi CBD feeds a radius of 40 km from its epicentre.

Land 50km and above from nairobi will need its own economic activity for sustenance. She could have done a JV with Amiran for the greenhouse farming or anything that can generate income to the occupants. Another solution was to design the houses such that construction cost is far much lower.

The same situation will befall Konza city investors who do not plan well.
Buildings, no matter how smart they are, do not exist without other factors such as proximity to existing cities/towns, proximity to raw materials etc etc.


You still can't see it people. I once had a chat with a man who after retirement, he went to his rural home in nyahururu. After a year he come back and rented a house in ruai. During his working days he decided to develop his rural home where he built a house and other farm infrastructure. Recently him and his son started to pay for one of those houses at kisaju and now lives there and his wife.
The reason he couldn't live in his rural area was because according to him one grows old ten times much faster in ocha than in Tao
He considers that since Nairobi metropolis comes all the way to kitengela, he is better of at kisaju than in nyahururu


@ mpobiz

You might wish to explain why we have a large number of old population in shags than in town...what is that special that rural folk eat that urban don't which makes them live longer than?

let me try to explain.
Most of the old people you see in shags are not there by choice they are sort of condemned there. If you could ask them they would tell you they would rather die young in the city rather than die slow in shags. Please you don't mean to say there isn't a sizable number of elderly folks in this city enjoying the city life.
you don't expect someone who has been employed In town for more than 40 years to adopt very easily to life in ocha land after retirement. (this includes you wazuans)
I hope this also answers the ageing 10 times faster in shags question.
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
murchr
#15 Posted : Tuesday, July 16, 2013 1:35:53 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,952
Just make life in Nrb expensive and this makao will be full in no time with all sorts of extensions developing
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
symbols
#16 Posted : Thursday, July 18, 2013 1:09:08 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/19/2013
Posts: 2,552
mpobiz wrote:
Kaigangio wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
a4architect.com wrote:
maka wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
[quote=a4architect.com]check their position on google maps. They r in the middle of nowhere. Their ability to communicate with nairobi cbd which provides employment has been severly hampered.
https://maps.google.com/...rovince,+Kenya&z=16[/quote]


mboss we,, this houses were not designed for people like you
Remember their add on TV starring the likes of jalango their target market was clear. The only problem is that it did not reach them in masses . Owning a house for many people is a dream, no matter the location.


Boss have you been to Kisaju?
You cant stay in this place and work in Nairobi...labda rongai or kiserian and thats still far btw this means you,ll have to rent another house for easier access to your work/business area and still pay a mortgagees on your kisaju house which will most likely have no tenant coz no one would want to live there...I had said it before this was not a properly planned project to early for such an area.


@maka..very brilliant observation. Ingrid Munro is an architect so she should have known better. Nairobi CBD feeds a radius of 40 km from its epicentre.

Land 50km and above from nairobi will need its own economic activity for sustenance. She could have done a JV with Amiran for the greenhouse farming or anything that can generate income to the occupants. Another solution was to design the houses such that construction cost is far much lower.

The same situation will befall Konza city investors who do not plan well.
Buildings, no matter how smart they are, do not exist without other factors such as proximity to existing cities/towns, proximity to raw materials etc etc.


You still can't see it people. I once had a chat with a man who after retirement, he went to his rural home in nyahururu. After a year he come back and rented a house in ruai. During his working days he decided to develop his rural home where he built a house and other farm infrastructure. Recently him and his son started to pay for one of those houses at kisaju and now lives there and his wife.
The reason he couldn't live in his rural area was because according to him one grows old ten times much faster in ocha than in Tao
He considers that since Nairobi metropolis comes all the way to kitengela, he is better of at kisaju than in nyahururu


@ mpobiz

You might wish to explain why we have a large number of old population in shags than in town...what is that special that rural folk eat that urban don't which makes them live longer than?

let me try to explain.
Most of the old people you see in shags are not there by choice they are sort of condemned there. If you could ask them they would tell you they would rather die young in the city rather than die slow in shags. Please you don't mean to say there isn't a sizable number of elderly folks in this city enjoying the city life.
you don't expect someone who has been employed In town for more than 40 years to adopt very easily to life in ocha land after retirement. (this includes you wazuans)
I hope this also answers the ageing 10 times faster in shags question.


Not completely.I'm very curious about how social factors affect real estate trends.The aging factor I've heard of but I am yet to understand.From the younger generations(i.e. non-retirees),I hear they say that rural areas make one comfortable or slow because one is idolized rather than challenged in that setting.So for the older generation,what is the driving force?A challenge,the fast life,proximity to family....I think it's an important factor to understand because retirees tend to have money to spend and thus affect real estate trends.
webish
#17 Posted : Monday, July 22, 2013 9:39:44 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/19/2009
Posts: 670
Location: Nairobi
one of the employee who is a friend tells me, that some occupants started defaulting a while back, and that fluctuating interest is/was not the main issue. Monthly payment is.

As it is, case is between financier and occupants.
(of course, this may be biased since the person is employed there).

Life is joy, death is peace, but the transition is very difficult.
a4architect.com
#18 Posted : Monday, July 22, 2013 6:36:46 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 1,668
Location: nairobi
The distance off tarmac, over 7km plus the distance from cbd, over 50km to me is the main chalenge towards residents being able to pay. Ingrid Munroe should have either worked a site n service scheme or just sold raw land to the people.
As Iron Sharpens Iron, So one Man Sharpens Another.
GalMU
#19 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2013 3:53:10 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 1/4/2013
Posts: 35
a4architect.com wrote:
Rankaz13 wrote:
wanyee wrote:
have always have the opinion that besides everything else ..most of these slum dwellers have a psychological problem


Here I was thinking it's purely an economic issueSad Sad


@wanyee.. its more of an economic issue. Life in the slum is quite rough, hence the occupants sometimes acting they way they do. Its more of learnt socialized behavior than inborn trait.



I was afraid to say this loudly but i have always wondered how a person with land in Kisumu,Kakamega or Muranga live in Nairobi in inhuman environs----its hatred for their home????
majimaji
#20 Posted : Wednesday, July 24, 2013 4:13:34 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 4/4/2007
Posts: 1,160

People, lets get the facts right:

the majority of people in Nairobi live in slums and informal settlements because simply that is what their incomes afford.
secondly, in Kenya we have tyranny of land ownership: few own big vacant lands ie the Kirimas, the Kenyatta's, the Njonjo's whoever. Until there are incentives or penalties to dispose such undeveloped land, land inflation will always be here.
I may have 10 acres in Kakamega but the income from farming may not be steady,I may want my kids to go to particular schools and of course other amenities that are found in the towns is an incentive; thus may prefer kayole to shags
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