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Algorithm Trading (metals, energies, currencies etc)
#41 Posted : Monday, December 10, 2018 10:32:54 PM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 11/21/2018
Posts: 16
Location: Nairobi
TNT wrote:
Dennis2018 wrote:
TNT wrote:
Dennis2018 wrote:
TNT wrote:
Dennis2018 wrote:
TNT wrote:
SamuelWachira wrote:
TNT suggestion is

1.Be ranked number one in Zulu trade or such other third party sites
2.Have performances of triple digit performance annually (100%+)
3.Investors will throw money at you.

Without turning this topic to discussion about performances-real or fake, sustainable or not, I think it is a possible route to raise money only that it is very idealistic(overly optimistic or lacks practicality).

Though you might top in Zulutrade, we know the probability is quite low. However, that does not translate to a 23% performance is not worthy of an investor’s attention. Yaani, Airtel bado wako na customers hata kama Safaricom are so dominant. In this case, if Dennis can pull that 23% it is definitely worthy by all standards regardless of kama kuna mtu amefanya 200% or whatever.

That brings me to the an assumption you are making: Having a very high performance is equals to getting very many investors. Extra high performance numbers actually indicate bad things –scam, blowups. Side note: Third party sites like Zulutrade are Good for instance to verify performances though there is so much negative to write about them on how they negatively affect your trading process. Volume monthly limits, you have to use brokers of their own choice, and a bunch of other rules. These rules are designed for their business models and not your trading welfare. Wrote matlab code for Quantiacs.com and the rules literally meant throwing away my edge so as to fit in.
Performance is the contentious one. As much as performance is the bread and butter of trading/investing activities there is little value to be gained by discussing on performances in light of the raising money question. But I have Designed a simple poll regarding the relation of raising money and promised/historical performance and probably we can settle using the results, feel free to fill it and I will share the results here : https://docs.google.com/...b1g/viewform?usp=pp_url

I'm making no assumptions here. The reality is the Zulutrade platform currently holds close to KES. 4 billion of investors money, which means investors trust Zulutrade ranking system.

What you clearly don't understand is how Zulutrade ranking system works, including its metrics.

Still, this is a simple issue. If investors on the Zulutrade platform have invested more than 1 billion with the number one trader on that platform, all you need to do to get that one billion is beat the number one trader. You defeat the king, you become the king and in the process, attract investors in droves.

To me, that is easier than looking for a single investor to pony up $3 million, especially if your algo does what you say it does.

There is one big assumption you are making...we are all using the SAME TRADING STRATEGY...Different players, different strategies and thats why the first thing any knowledgeable investor will ask you is...Whats your strategy??? Are you long/short equity, market neutral, managed futures, distressed, global macro, equity long only, arbitrage, commodities only, currencies...etc...After that they would like to know...What is your time frame?? Are you a short term trader, swing trader, long term trader...etc... So at no point can you expect our returns to be the same... Moreover, there is a high probability those zulu trade platform their strategies are totally different from mine...I can bet you referring to high frequency trading (HFT)...and my strategy is not HFT, so you cant compare apples and oranges...

As i said different investors look at different things, and as Samuel puts it, its not about returns only...Yeah you can be making 100% return but with a drawdown of 50%...Well to some investors those are red flags for a potential blow up....

I have said there are more than 250K+ trading algorithms on Zuluetrade, so how am I assuming that you're all using the same strategy?

Secondly, Zulutrade has stringent drawdown requirements, capping DD at 33%. Additionally, Zulutrade adheres to EU trading regulations, including the recently enacted margin requirements.

Maybe you should first familiarize yourself with how Zulutrade platform works before you make any more comments regarding the platform.

Well the zulutrade platform you keep on referring to is for mimicking "FOREX" trading...It is a forex trading platform. As i said before what us we are doing is "FUTURES" trading not Forex... different markets, different strategies and zulu trade does not offer our kind of specialty. Currencies is just one component of futures, we are also talking about energies, stock indices, government bonds, agricultures, and metals. Basically we are talking upwards of 50 markets where the system trades to generate returns....

You're contradicting yourself. The title of your post reads, " Algorithm Trading (metals, energies, currencies etc)". Now, last time I checked, forex trading meant currency trading. Secondly, you've also talked about selling EUR/USD (a forex pair). Then, you've just said, "..doing is "FUTURES" trading not Forex..."

Anyway, if you're not trading forex, then all I've said is null and void. Good luck finding an investor.

No contradiction whatsoever. Yes, we are trading currencies but futures data is different from the spot data (forex). Futures are standardized forward contracts which expire after a specified period of time in the future. Futures currencies are based on the spot market (forex), but trade either at a higher price or lower price. For example, the futures price for EUR/USD can trade at a higher price or lower price than the prevailing forex price (spot). As such, you cannot use the spot forex data to trade the futures data. Moreover, futures trade at an exchange, as such unlike the cash market (e.g. forex), where different participants see different prices (depending on the broker), pricing is centralized and all market participants have access to the same wholesale Bid and Ask prices.

With that said you cant use the forex data to trade the futures market...those are two different markets. As such, you need a broker who has access to futures markets and such brokers are rare due to tighter regulation and gaining access to exchanges. Zulu trade is a copy trading platform or maybe a forex broker (fewer transparency and regulations....That is why you have heard about brokers trading against you since most trades are not routed to the market but the broker takes the opposite side of your trade...In that case, it is in the brokers best interest to manipulate your trades so that you loose...I believe you have heard of issues like markets/ screen freezing or being filled at the bottom or high)...You don't get such issues in futures since all trades are routed through to the exchange.

I hope that clarification is clear on why the forex data and futures data are different even though you are trading the same market.

Any forex broker that offers MT4 or MT5 platform, offers CFD/Futures contracts, so futures contracts are not as special as you insinuate. However, for me, futures contacts are inherently more risky than spot forex because of the fixed price and fixed expiry date. It's like trading binary options.

CFD..Yes, most forex brokers offer, but CFD is a small market..Futures, it may depend with what you want to trade and which country or exchange the asset is traded...because the futures market is big since every spot market has a futures market...

Yes, I agree with you on that.. futures are risky but i guess, everything is risky (forex included)..I guess it comes down to having a sound/ statistically valid strategy, proper risk management and always hedging your risk... Never bet the farm..smile
To know that we know what we know, and that we do not know, what we do not know; that is true knowledge. - CONFUCIUS
#42 Posted : Saturday, April 13, 2019 6:08:26 PM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 1/15/2019
Posts: 30
I think that futures contracts are mostly used for hedging the risk. There are traders who developed some trading strategies on future contracts like price differentials, but I find them a bit complicated to trade. Considering that earnings are questionable, I just gave up on idea to trade futures
S.Mutaga III
#43 Posted : Saturday, April 13, 2019 11:53:29 PM
Rank: Member

Joined: 3/26/2012
Posts: 811
People like throwing terms around like algorithm trading etc. Most hedge funds use those algorithms. Most hedge funds underperform the market after fees. Plain and simple. I wouldn't substitute my brain for an algorithm. The trick to making money in any market is being knowledgeable and minimizing activity. In my opinion, specifically for stocks, a smart individual investor is likely to outperform most hedge funds on an annualized basis. Lastly, kindly direct me to a platform where I can invest in stocks or their futures, and where I can attract investors if I build a track record.
A successful man is not he who gets the best, it is he who makes the best from what he gets.
#44 Posted : Monday, May 06, 2019 11:16:57 AM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 12/28/2018
Posts: 58
Location: Helsingborg, Sweden
I think it's close to impossible to obtain that contacts anyway with such high amount needed. I also agree with skeptics here who post that people who earned that money do not need people on forums with their systems and theories. If your system is so good start with what you have really.
#45 Posted : Thursday, May 23, 2019 12:17:08 PM
Rank: New-farer

Joined: 4/12/2019
Posts: 16
I have a simple question for TNT. If you are ready to beat all companies on Zulutrade, then why would you search for any investor. Just trade for your own money and enjoy life of being extremely rich person
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